When to use 24fps or 30fps to film

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    • #71338
      AvatarGrimy D Beats
      Participant

      We filmed this at 30fps should we do it in 24fps? what are good situations to film 24 or 30

       

    • #209256
      AvatarWoody
      Participant

      It depends on the camera. Some cameras suffer whats called "Rolling shutter" effects more than others. It has to do with camera movement and how fast the sensor captures the image. A lot of people are hung up on 24p for cinematic reasons but if your using a camera that easily produces "Wobble" or "Skew" with camera movement then your not going to get a very cinematic product from them. Using a higher frame rate helps reduce rolling shutter effects.

       

      Most people can't tell a difference between 24p or 30p anyway and what they recognize about a cinematic look is more so related to the "Look", meaning coloring, grain and such. I also think your editing technique goes a long ways in giving the audience the "Feel" of cinema. I believe 24p can add to the look but only if the motion is a part of what you're after or a dominant element visually.

       

      Your show is really something that falls under a "Genre" where a digital look is widely accepted. If you branched out to where you were adding a visual story to the music, then it would pay off to get cinematic about things but the dual commentary part is fine in a digital look. I think you would go farther in pleasing your audience by having both people mic'd up with lav's rather than passing a hand held back and fourth.

       

      There are so many other things to worry about getting done well that I really feel the difference between 24 and 30 fps to be a very minor issue.

       

       

    • #209258
      Avatargldnears
      Member

      Most people can't tell a difference between 24p or 30p anyway and what they recognize about a cinematic look is more so related to the "Look", meaning coloring, grain and such. "

       

       

      Oh! And don't forget that treasured effect of film jitterring side to side as it passes through a worn projector gate! I don't think anybody has yet written a software program which emulates this authentic " film look " in digital videotape land.

       

      The most valid reason to shoot in 24p would be if one intended to distribute their work, actually on film!

    • #209277
      AvatarJKnight
      Member

      Here is what you should do. Record in 30p with your camera, always record in 30 FPS. Then when your editing your sequence should be in 23.976. When you edit the 30 fps footage into the 23.976 sequence of timeline, the 7 extra frames will be simply cut out, but the footage will play back at the same pace as it was recorded. This gives you the benefit of of 30 fps ( no issues with too much motion blur, rolling shutter etc.) that you might experience recording at 23.976 but then when you export it will be in 23.976FPS which will have the cinematic motion to it. 

       

      Knight Media, http://www.knightmedia.us

    • #213899
      Avatargldnears
      Member

      Converting 60 FPS to 24 or 25 doesn’t come out ‘ even ‘, so you end up with some frames being repeated or dropped. In general I’d say to shoot in whatever frame rate your distribution format requires. Converting anything to anything else is messy and I sincerely doubt you’ll wind up with anything that looks ‘ cinematic ‘ in the end.

    • #213901
      Avatargat3keeper
      Member

      Thank Rick

      So is it safe to say for travel videos, 24 fps is safe if I just want to have a cinematic look ?

    • #213910
      Avatarpaulears
      Participant

      What I do not get at all, is why you don;t shoot the same thing three times, and then view it and make your own mind up as to which works. I’m in the UK, and I now shoot virtually everything at 50fps, because I can. To my eyes it looks good, is quite smooth, and will play on most systems. Converting is a fudge. If you want to output to youtube or vimeo as your primary medium, then shoot in something that will be affected the least by their conversion process.

    • #215271

      The only reason film was shot at 24 fps is because it cut down on the cost of production. It was the slowest film rate which seemed seamless and not photos or “pictures”.

      We use Autodesk Smoke and our editor changes film rates all the time with no problems at all. The problems of yesterday aren’t problems today.

    • #277931
      AvatarFred Stork
      Member

      Are we not forgetting something important in this discussion? What about the distribution/projection of the film? Most of our productions will be viewed on computers, tablets or phones. With a few exceptions computerscreens, tablets and phone screens are 30/60 fps (yes, even in 50hz countries) – meaning that your “cinematic” 24 fps footage will be viewed in 30 fps and this through a transformation outside of your control. The result is that any fast motion will appear choppy/stuttery (panning, moving objects etc.) in an all but cinematic way. The real difference between cinematic and video type images is not in the minor difference between 24 and 30 fps and the downside of 24 fps is not justified – unless you control the entire chain. 24 fps will in most cases be viewed in 30 fps while 30fps will next to never be viewed in 24 fps…

      Just my 2 cents and I could be wrong…

    • #278068
      Avatarjojo1979
      Member

      I am new to recording and editing videos. My main focus is music videos. I am an artist trying to promote myself an its very useful to be able to do the things yourself that cost the most. I started off just using my cell phone to get footage then i would take those videos an put them in a editing program and create my video. After doing a lot then comparing to videos i would see on youtube or other sites i started realizing i wasnt getting the music video look while editing it just looked like clips to music. First i thought it was my transitions so i studied that but still i wasnt getting the look. After watching numerous tutorials i saw how most music videos are shot at 24fps and i downloaded a dslr camera app to my phone which allowed me to change the frame rate to 24 an i immediately saw the difference the clips looked lile music video clips. So i then shot with a old video camera i had that also allowed u to change the frame rate an those clips looked good as well. Problem now is i got me a nikon cool pix B500 for christmas this is my 1st digital camera an i thought this would be a great upgrade but when u go to change the frame rate it only offers 25, 30, 60. I have numerous questions 1. Do u have to record at 24fps to get the music video look also what can you do in editing to get that real music video look? Im so new to all of this i didnt even know what frame rate is also i would be honored if you guys can check some of my videos out an tell me how i can improve. I am a whole rookie no schooling or anything please help you can find me on youtube under rap ceo here is a link to 2 videos fire i shot at 24frames with a video camera and the other jus a straight camera from my phone before i learned of frame rate.


    • #209265
      AvatarGrimy D Beats
      Participant

      Apreciate your feedback, from what you said well keep it 30fps, and yea passing the mic around does kinda does look unprofesional were gonna fix that soon, Thanks Woody! – Grimy D

    • #213894
      Avatargat3keeper
      Member

      So in layman’s term, when to shoot 24fps vs 30fps vs 60fps ?

      Is it safe to record 60fps always and just convert it to 24 or 25 fps in post-production ?

    • #213904
      Avatargldnears
      Member

      Mr Knight had good advice

    • #214889

      If you ever want to sell your video or at least give copies to your friends on DVD or Blu-Ray you would be well advised to shoot 24p instead of 30p since DVD and Blu-Ray do not support 30p. The frame rate conversion is ugly with lots of digital artifacts. I don’t shoot 30p or 60p for anything except slow motion in my 24p projects.

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