Move from DSLR to Camcorder, need advice

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    • #72266
      Avatarevetsmd
      Participant
      Hi Guys…I've been helping my Church with some short 10 to 15 minute videos using 
      my Nikon D7000 DSLR…….
       
      The short videos have worked well and now the request is can I record an entire Service, maybe about 1 hour long then put it on YouTube or Vimeo. Idea is to make it available for sick and shut in's.
       
      I went to the Church yesterday with my d7000 to do some testing.
       
      video settings: – video shot from the back of the church, about 70 feet
      • 1080 P – high def.
      • 24 FPS
      • Shutter speed 1/50 sec
      • Lens Focal Length – 55mm (35 mm equivalent is 88 mm) – using my 18 to 200mm (1.6 crop factor) f3.5 to 5.8
      • shot in full manual mode to be able to adjust variables of aperture and iso
       
      to maintain some depth of field I picked an aperture of F 7.1 (gives an in-focus range
      of 35' to infinite) – calculations after I got home would indicate I could probably
      open the lens all the way and still have no problems with depth of field/focus. 
       
      here's the problem…because of the low light in the Church (even though everything was turned on), to do the above I needed to push the ISO up to 3200. This is very high and looking close u can see the noise in the video.
       
      audio is not good but my thinking is to record off the Church mixer and sync during edit. (Adobe Premier Pro CS3)
       
      Anyway a couple thoughts:
      I can only record for 20 minutes max on my Nikon and my next move would then be to a Pro Camcorder like the Panasonic AG-AC90 or…..how about the  Panasonic GH3 with a big glass lens like (28 to 85mm) 35mm equivalent.
      GH3 has no limits on video record time…..
       
      Don't know how to compare the GH3 versus the AG-AC90 approach….also don't even know if these cameras are the best choice. I'm open to any and all inputs. Like I said I've managed to work my way thru these short 10 to 15 min videos but jumoing up to an hour long video and what equipment to consider is all new 
       
      What do you think? How's the best way to approach this?
       
      Thank a lot!
       
       
    • #209688

      Hi using the nikon D7000 to record for a period of time is no problem. I'm a wedding videographer and I shoot with 3 nikon D7000 and true as it is you only get 20 mins of recording time with the DSLR , the way I over came that issue is use 2 DSLRs at different angles and monitor the time on both cameras. When the 20 mins is close to running out on one camera the other camera will keep recording and you can stop the one nikon that is reaching its limit and restart it after 30 seconds. I have recorded a church service that ran 2 1/2 hours and I got everything recorded without any issues and had no problems with my nikons. When you edited the footage will show different angles but you will get all the footage recorded. Hope this was helpful and good luck.

    • #209699
      Avatarmcrockett
      Member

           I don't know about the GH3, but I own the GH2, and it is a great camera. I use it as my static wide shot for recording live performances. I can record continuously with it. It splits the video into 4 GB files, but I can use the Windows copy command to concatinate the video files into one seamless file. I would think that the GH3 would be an even further improvement on the already great GH2, but look for some reviews before deciding on that one. 

           As far as trying to overcome the 20 minute limit of the D7000 by timing with other cameras, as Michael explained, that is an unnecessary headache that any videographer should try to avoid. 

           If my GH2 is any indication of what the GH3 is, then I would say that the GH3 is worth a look. 

    • #209700
      Avatarjdsimons2
      Participant

      You can do it with the DSLR, but the time limit will become tedious and does require a tad bit more effort in post. I would invest in a Prosumer Camcorder which will free you up to be doing other things rather than waiting for the 20 min mark to restart the camera(s).

    • #209701
      Avatarevetsmd
      Participant

      Thanks for the inputs

    • #209706
      Avatargldnears
      Member

      Just curious . . . . why do you feel you need a shallow depth of field when shooting a church service?

       

      Also, shooting at a distance of 70 feet, my guess would be that you're going to need to be zoomed in quite a bit . . . which will make ANY slight camera movement jerkey and not smooth. Panning to follow a pacing pastor will be next to impossible.

    • #209707
      Avatarevetsmd
      Participant

      Hi…wouldn't be following anyone…..camera would be set at 55mm for duration. Not worried about

      panning or moving…..

       

      DOF – from my calculations I think I can open the lens all the way and still have plenty of DOF. Opening the lens would let me drop the ISO.

       

      Thanks

    • #209725
      AvatarBruce
      Participant

      I specalize in  live events. 

      I normally run a Canon t2i as my primary.  With Magic Lantern firmware it will record continuously but with about 3 second gaps every 12 minutes.  My secont camera is a Canon Vixia HF M300 camcorder which is placed at a different angle and run fixed angle and focus.  Finally I use a Zoom H4n to record off the board and simultaneously get crowd response.  In most situations I am short of light so run f:4 and 1600iso on the t2i.  The two cameras leave me the opportunity to cover the gaps and any awkward zooms or pans with the primary.  The two views also add interest.

      Editing with all this media takes about 4X the show time but I think it comes out well.

    • #209726
      Avatarslewisma
      Participant

      If the D7000's low light abilities don't meet your needs, a prosumer camcorder will probably disappoint you too as the sensor will be smaller. As far as I know, the GH2/ GH3 will also have the 20 minute limit. The still camera manufacturers are happy to add video ability but don't want to pay the high import fees for video cameras. 

      Before you spend a ton on a camera and lens that is suited to low light, is there anything that can be done to up the light level a bit? The current lighting was designed before the request to record and publish the video of the service online so it might be a good time to see if something simple can be done (ie. brighter, longer lasting, lower electricity consuming LEDs in existing fixtures) or a light or two (LED or flourescent soft lights) can be added inconspicuously before assuming a very expensive camera setup is required. 

       

      I've shot concerts (very low light) with a Canon Vixia HF-G20. At typical YouTube size, the noise wan't an issue. Can you borrow a similar model from someone to try in your church's lighting? Even the $200 Canon R400 might work if you can up the lighting a bit. 

    • #209727
      Avatarhhaf
      Member

      You can buy very reasonable LED lights from retailers like http://www.linkdelight.om and do great. With a camera that is not that light sensitive.  Recently shot a schooldance, and used a Nikon D600 at 6400 ISO wt a 10 LED lighton top, and had to use he minimum light setting to get a "dark room" feel.The added light really helped. At a lower ISO seing I'd have t ue mor light, but even a 160 diode light – it had plenty more to give.

       

      Using two cameras will also give a change of viewing angle that adds to the interest for the viewer. It also enables you to overcome the limit on shots. Perhaps a collection in the church can help with the cost.

    • #209731
      AvatarAnonymous
      Inactive

      for live church services, have you thought about doing live streams ?

      http://new.livestream.com/live-video-tools

      shows you can just use your iphone type devices and stream straight to the net for live viewers – it’ll also record a file for you also for playback streams.. and you can mutlicam this live also using ipad apps etc.. cheap and easy solution for this type of events.. πŸ™‚

      even live stream from gopro’s dotted around the stage via $500 box http://store.livestream.com/products/livestream-broadcaster haha.. you get idea anyhow..

      or live stream off a couple of iphones to a notebook or usb webcams stuck on light stands doted around the place.. im sure you can high-jack a couple of friends iphone at the service for a couple of hours πŸ™‚

      it’ll save you editing and uploading later on and you can mix vfx / graphics titles subtitles etc on the fly live just like a mini tv station.. food for thought πŸ™‚

    • #209733
      Avatarevetsmd
      Participant

      I need to tell u guy hw much I appreciate the inputs. Thanks…. I use Premiere Pro to edit, live streaming won't work, ISP doesn't offer sufficient speeds and Bandwidth costs for a 1 hour stream are cost prohibitive. Using all ur ideas to enhance video could work but I also need to work on getting audio recorded from the mixer. Biggest problem is that this has turned out to be a one man project so I'm looking for a helper and progress is slow…..keep those suggestions coming and I'll keep u updated on my progress…..Thanks 

    • #209728
      Avatarslewisma
      Participant

      What are you editing in? I do a very similar thing with D7000 and Vixia HF-G20 and a Zoom. I use multicam in FCP X to sync them all up by audio. Next I color grade to try to get the two cameras to look more alike. Then I do a multicam edit for a fast rough cut (I set the audio to whatever blend of board and room I want from the Zoom and just switch video via the multicam angles). I then watch it through and adjust any of my initial cuts to match scene, mood, music, etc. to look and feel better, add titles and lower thirds as needed and I'm done. The hardest part is the color grading since the Nikon DLSR and Canon Camcorder aren't well matched. 

      One big advantage of the DSLR footage is that it is high enough quality that I can simulate zooms and dollies in post within reasonable limits. 

    • #209729
      Avatarslewisma
      Participant

      What are you editing in? I do a very similar thing with D7000 and Vixia HF-G20 and a Zoom. I use multicam in FCP X to sync them all up by audio. Next I color grade to try to get the two cameras to look more alike. Then I do a multicam edit for a fast rough cut (I set the audio to whatever blend of board and room I want from the Zoom and just switch video via the multicam angles). I then watch it through and adjust any of my initial cuts to match scene, mood, music, etc. to look and feel better, add titles and lower thirds as needed and I'm done. The hardest part is the color grading since the Nikon DLSR and Canon Camcorder aren't well matched. 

      One big advantage of the DSLR footage is that it is high enough quality that I can simulate zooms and dollies in post within reasonable limits. 

    • #209730
      AvatarBruce
      Participant

      Hi,  Have you ever heard of parallel evolution?  Sounds like you and I independently developed a very similar workflow.  I too struggle with color matching.  I edit to 720p so I can create 50% zoom tracks at different central postions to do the multi-camera editing.  I use Adobe Premiere CC for editing.  I am looking forward to buying a Canon 70D so that matching will be much easier.  I will use the t2i as the second camera then.

    • #209734
      AvatarBruce
      Participant

      You might see if your local college or community college has a film program.  Students often would be happy to  help for the experience. 

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