Green Screen Filming Advise

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    • #82721
      AvatarT1T5
      Participant
      firstly hi to all members
       
      this is the first time i have tried to make a video using green screen and i have set myself this challenge to do so.
      i already have made a green screen set which is in my garage and have adequate lighting for the video i wish to shoot.
      i only have a Sony handy-cam digital 8  dcr-tr7000e in its day quite a good cam which i hope is ok as for now to get me started.
      i have now got a new laptop which should be adequate for the software i wish to use for editing etc which is for the moment Photoshop cc4.and will be getting easy green screen to run with it.
       
      the video i want to make is a music video, with me in the video lip sinking to a audio track with also me in the video at the same time playing guitar stand up bass and stand up drums so it forms a band standing in front of a back drop from my new CD logo picture.
      here is how i want it to look like when viewed on screen with individual shots of each band member at different times through the video, ie guitar solo backing vox etc
       
                                                    drums
                                         guitar                bass
       
                                                    singer
       
      that is the gist of what i would like to do so is this possible with the items i have to use, any advise would be appreciated 
      thanks for viewing
      rockin-tj 
       
    • #211163
      Avatarmcrockett
      Member

           It kind of sounds like the video you want to make is a little bit out of the league of your equipment.  As far as your camera goes, you are going to want something newer, that shoots HD video, with at least a 4:2:2 chroma sub-sampling ratio.  Your current camera is so old that I can't even find out what the chroma sub-sampling ratio is, not to mention the fact that it's not an HD camera.

           For your eding software, you'll want to use something that is actually designed to edit video, like Adobe Premiere or Sony Vegas.  Newer versions of Photoshop can be used to do some basic video editing, but that doesn't mean they should.  And for what you want to do, you'll want to use an actual NLE for video.

           When you say that you've "made" a green screen set, what do you mean?  What did you use?  Certain shades of green work better than others for chroma keying, and the best way to know that you're using the right shade of green is to purchase a green screen that was manufactured specifically for this use.

    • #211169
      AvatarT1T5
      Participant

      thanks for the reply

      please can you tell why the cam has to be hd as i dont understand why

      set was brought from a company called green screen technology and the material is recomended for Chroma Key .

      apart from not having the right items for what i would like to do is it still possible to do a video with me as the band members and me as the singer on veiw at the same time once i have got a new cam and other software and what is the skill level for this .

      please understand this is all new to me so simple answers would be easer to understand

      thanks tj

    • #211170
      Avatarmcrockett
      Member

           I suppose that it doesn't have to be HD, but it does have to be more powerful than what you have. But today, all cameras that are currently being manufactured are either HD or 4K capable.  But for the best result, you need to make sure that the chroma sub-sampling ratio is 4:2:2 or better.  4:4:4 is the best, but you will fork out a pretty penny for that.

           Your green screen set sounds like it is adequate for what you want to do.  Although, it may not be necessary.  You can shoot your scenes multiple times, placing yourself each time where one of the band members will be.  You can do this without the green screen, and use the background that you want.  Just be sure that you never move the camera.  Then, once you have each clip in the timeline of your NLE of choice, you use the entire frame of one of the clips, keeping it on the bottom track of the stack of clips, and then put the other clips in their own individual tracks.  You then mask around each other band member in the other tracks, so that the footage from the tracks below shows through the masks.  This way you won't have to worry about how well your green screen is lit, or having to pull a perfect key, as it takes the need for a green screen out of the equation.  It would also mean that you won't have to worry as much about the chroma sub-sampling ratio of your camera.  This is actually a fairly easy effect to pull off.  Let me know if you have any other questions.

    • #211176
      AvatarT1T5
      Participant

      thanks for the reply

      please can you tell me the following 

       

      1 what would be the out come if the cam i have was used

      2 what does NLE mean.

      3 are there any tutorials for what i want to do on the site or do you know of any

      thanks tj

    • #211177
      Avatarmcrockett
      Member

      1.  If you use a green screen, the keys you pull will look aweful.  There will probably be a noticeable off-color halo around your subjects, and I would imagine that any quick movement (like that of the drummer) will give you an off-color blur around the parts that are moving, and your audience will easily be able to tell that you used a green screen, and did a poor job of it.  Also, it will look dated.  We have been in an era of HD for many years now.  In fact, we're starting to leave the HD era in favor of a 4K era.  Even if you don't use a green screen, and just use masks in your NLE to mask around multiple subjects, and put them all into the same frame, 1) you won't have as much real estate on the screen to work with, because your resolution is lower and you will probably be using a 4:3 aspect ratio instead of a 16:9 aspect ratio, and 2) it will look like you shot it on a camera that is probably 10 years old, or older.  Today's cameras give you a much better image to work with.

      2.  NLE stands for Non-Linear Editor.  Basically, it means that you are importing the video files into a program that will show you a preview of the outcome of the adjustments you make to the files in the project that you have created in that program.  Then, when you go to render your project from the program, it creates a new video file, building it frame by frame, based on the video files that you've imported into the project and the changes that you've made within the project.  In other words, you're not editing the video files themselves; you're editing the project in the program into which the video files have been imported.  The outcome is a new video file, but the original video files are untouched.

      3.  Tutorials are all over the Internet.  Do a Google search on pulling a key from a green screen, or on using masks in whatever NLE you decide to use.  If you learn better by watching someone else do it, do searches on YouTube.

    • #211181
      AvatarT1T5
      Participant

      thanks for the reply

      its looks like a new cam to begin with. ( type of music is 1950 rockabilly and footage from that erea  guess you could say same age as the cam corder )

      i will look on ebay but can you advise on a one which will be able to do the project but will not cost me a arm and leg to begin with , i could always upgrade to a better one later ( as i might not be any good at what i want to do )  all projects will be for youtube only and for my own website not for sell to the public 

      thanks tj

    • #211186
      Avatarmcrockett
      Member

           One camera in my arsenal is the Sony HXR-NX30u.  It has been a good camera, and it can do green screen, if you decide that you must use the green screen.  If you will not need the green screen, you can go with a lower model.  If you go with a more consumer-grade camera, stick with the Sony cameras.  In my experience, they will give you the best image.

    • #211188
      Avatarpaulears
      Participant

      HD?? 4K???

       

      Come on guys – we've been doing perfectly acceptable green screen for years with composite video, and then HD. Some people may well be leaving HD for 4K, but they are NOT representative of the entire industry. It's true that the DLSR people have moved fast, and now the large sensor enthusiasts are going up again, but they are still pioneers. So much still ends up on DVD in SD, and we're still watching TV programmes recorded before HD even existed. What matters is sharp edges, and decent lighting. The 4K people often have real issues because of the soft edges that accidentally happen when DoF is very shallow. 

       

      First thing is to try your old camera with something like Premiere or Vegas or any of the proper editors and see what the results are? The keyer in Premiere is the one developed by serious magic, and was an incredible SD keyer – Adobe took the best bits.What you need to do is get space between you (the subject) and the green background. Proper chromakey green or blue paint is a very 'pure' colour, and it looks vivid, but ordinary green emulsion is fine if it is even, and the same colour. You need to light it so as the brightness is consistent – no hot or dark spots, and then make sure the subject is far enough away the green doesn't reflect onto the edges of the face and body. Your subject and screen lighting is separate – then, when the camera is adjusted to make the focus as sharp as you can get, even an old camera will key pretty well. Mess up the lighting or focus and it will be awful. I've been keying in 4:3 and 16:9 for a long time in SD on DV tape, and very rarely do I get problems that are down to the format – in the same way the BBC and ITV did before HD. Bad keying is usually bad lighting and setup – artiste too close to the screen, soft focus etc. The often commented on things like 4:2:2 or 4:2:0 etc are differences AFTER you got the lighting right. I don't shoot SD any more, even though most of my work ends up on DVD, but when I key greenscreen, on HD, it's not really much different to SD. The reasons given above are not wrong – just over emphasised, and what you are propsoing is what thousands of students on media course do – and it's perfectly possible with a proper editor. Go for it, and just be prepared to spend time on the setup and lighting. You really need about a couple of metres between the green surface and your subject – have you got this?

    • #211196
      AvatarT1T5
      Participant

      hi thanks for the reply.

      i think that i will go ahead and use the cam i have got for the time being ( and take on board the advise above  ) and take your advise on the software you have suggested  i am looking at sony vegas pro 12 or 13 .

      this is only a project to see how i get on in making a video and to learn from it, as i dont want to jump in the deep end and waste money if for some reason this is not for me .

      once again thanks for the advise

      tj

    • #211210
      Avatarpaulears
      Participant

      I think that's a good move – being honest, your first attempts will be a bit clunky, and you'll get plenty of experience jiggling the lighting – if you buy a really expensive camera, same thing applies – so your camera is great to start with. Back in the 70s, the BBC managed to do some great stuff with chroma key (and quite a lot of rubbish too) and you still see bad chroma keying on broadcast TV – especially with weather maps! I found a very old video clip I did years ago – SD in 4:3 that uses some chroma key tricks in it – it's not very good really, and is a very early version of the finished thing put on vimeo to show the client a rough idea of what it was going to be – so it's rough, but I've changed the permissions so you can see it. https://vimeo.com/1732769

       

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