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- This topic has 8 replies, 1 voice, and was last updated 11 years, 2 months ago by Anonymous.
February 4, 2010 at 4:47 PM #45881AnonymousInactive
experiment using house mixer. they had it mixed well for the live performance, but it could be better in the video. other than using multiple cameras, what could i have done to make this more interesting?
February 4, 2010 at 6:45 PM #189852
You did what many of us do starting out shooting with one camera, you just sat there. In truth you needed 2-3 cameras to shoot this to get better coverage. However, with a 1 camera shoot you can still do some things to liven up the video.
More than likely you were unable to move around to change angles, but you still could have zoomed in on the band members as they performed to get close-ups and medium shots. I know you were thinking ‘I have to keep it true to what they played’ or something like that. Yes and no you didn’t.
The shot you started off with was fine as an intro shot to lay some titles over but after about 5-7 seconds you should have zoomed in for a medium shot of the guitarist as he was talking. 3-5 seconds after he started talking, you could have zoomed in for a close up and may have been in time for him to intro the song. Once they started playing, you vary it up with combos of close ups and medium shots of the musicians as they played making sure to get a few extreme close ups of the singer to balance out the other shots.
If your lens would allow, you get some shots of the spotlighted musician’s hands as he played the instrument. Then as the song nears the end, you do a ‘pull out’ which brings you back to a slightly tighter framed shot than your original. With good timing you would have stopped your pull out just before they ended the song.
I’m not going to tell you doing that is easy ’cause it ain’t! It’s an acquired skill that takes lots of practice shooting something that will cut together well in the editing bay. The best way to learn it is two shoot their rehearsals using the above method. Even if you have two or more cameras you’re going to have to do some of this stuff anyway, it just won’t be the ‘full monty’ like with one camera. Long as your ‘main camera’ and or you have a recorder patched into the mixer for secondary audio, you should be able to cut something together that’s worth watching.
February 5, 2010 at 10:47 PM #189853AnonymousInactive
thanks for the reply. i was in a bit of a tight spot with the camera. had about 3 feet of slack coming from the mixer (6′ cable, 3ft across a table to the mixer), i also had the tripod jacked up about as high as it would go which made it very sensitive to any touch. i know, i know, the only reason i did it was because i was in the very back of the room and had to make sure i was above everybody. do you know of any video that shows a 1 camera shoot like this?
February 6, 2010 at 4:14 PM #189854Grinner HesterParticipant
Get some cut aways. A locked down shot for 6 minutes is a great way to get folks to click away quick.
I’d not lock it down at all. Walk around and get different angles of that very song. Then shoot other songs so you have quick cut aways. Sync is easy to fake, you’ll find. I shot the music video this way:
I got one take of the song. Hand held. No rehersal. I grabbed tight shots as needed as they played other songs so I’d have something to cover with. tripods and live bands just don’t mix, in my opinion.
February 6, 2010 at 5:00 PM #189855
How long have you been shooting? Of course you could “get it in one take, no rehearsal”. So could I. Head didn’t have a clue. Had he went to the rehearsals it might have occurred to him to do just as you mentioned. As for handheld vs tripods for concerts, I’ll take a rookie on a tripod than hand held every time. You’re right about “faking sync”. That’s a staple for editing concerts.
Grinner’s description of ‘walking around’ is what you’re going to end up doing for future ‘one camera shoots’. You’ll need a secondary source of audio that you can separately hook into the board to get even continuous sound. Then when their set starts, you keep your camera rolling for the entire set. If you’re running a tape-based camera, you’ve got as long as your tape is. Don’t give into the temptation to use the ‘LP’ setting to give your more recording time, your footage will look like crap. If you’re using a solid-state camera, long as you don’t have clip size and length limits, you should be cool.
Move around to get different angles of the band and crowd. Work it out prior to the shoot with the venue and the band as to where you can go and then take full advantage of it!
February 7, 2010 at 3:41 PM #189856AnonymousInactive
i see what you guys are saying, and now i’m thinking “duh why didn’t i think of that to start with?” i guess it was between running the mixer audio into the camera and thinking about shooting like i do when i video sports. it obviously didn’t cross over well. the shoot was also short notice, as in hey we’re playing tomorrow night can you come film us. they are friends of mine and i had heard them play before, but never with video in mind.
thanks for both the replies. i have another question. when you are filming this way what do you focus on, what shots are you trying to get, during the song and how do you grab the tight shots if you’re asked to film the whole show?
February 7, 2010 at 5:20 PM #189857
It’s your thinking about what ‘the whole show’ means. You as the shooter/editor must have a different concept of what ‘whole’ means. To the band, audience and viewer’s of the video, the concept of ‘whole’ means ‘the show and every little detail from start to finish’.
Since you’re shooting the event, depending on how many cameras you have available your concept of ‘whole’ will vary. In an ideal situation, you’ll have more than one camera. Camera #1 (Main Camera) would focus on the stage and the band and would cover their activities from start to finish. Camera #1 would also roll continuously to capture unbroken audio to be used later in the edit. Camera #2 or more would be your ‘rover(s)’ or ‘cut cameras’ which would move around the stage and venue to get those ‘cutaways’ Grinner mentioned. Ideally you would want to have those cameras rolling continuously too, but long as you had your main camera up that requirement wouldn’t be as necessary.
But, with a single camera shoot you have to do all of those things with one camera. However, as both Grinner and myself described, it can and has been done. So how do you “get those tight shots?” You just adapt what I said do when stuck on a tripod and combine it with Grinner’s explanation of moving around. The beauty of being a cameraman is; you’re not part of the audience so you can move around. In fact most time’s it’s expected.
So, despite it being a ‘short notice gig’, I’m sure Grinner would agree that now since you’ve done this once already, next time soon as you get tapped for another gig you do the following:
- Immediately contact the venue to let them know you’ll be there to shoot the event. Find out who your point of contact at the venue is and speak/meet with them asap.
- Look over the venue before the show to figure out where you can setup and get the go ahead on where you can be and where you can’t. If you do this beforehand, you will find those rules may be rather ‘fluid’ once the show starts and you can get away with more than you thought. Don’t abuse it though, because you may want to shoot there again if not get gigs from the venue themselves.
- Find out much as you can about what the band is going to play and if they do warm up sets before the show, take your camera and shoot some test footage to get an idea of how you want to shoot them.
- When the show starts, start from a position that allows you to get a shot of the band as the show begins. Once they get going good, move from your starting position and around the venue to get your shots. If you want to get ‘tight shots’, get closer to your subject. Because you are working nobody’s going to sweat you for getting onstage and close to the band. However, don’t stand in one spot for a thousand years! Get your closeups and get out. a good cutshot shouldn’t take you more than 10 seconds to get. Make sure you keep your camera rolling for the entire set and have a separate recorder hooked up to the board for insurance.
I suggest you watch concert footage to get an idea of shots and get an idea of where you’d need to be to get them. So, your concept of the show is the amount of ‘coverage’ you can get. That’s how much footage you can get to ‘cover’ the length of time of the recording and make it interesting. With one camera to get the ‘multi-camera’ look for your video, you’re going to have to do the work of a multi-camera crew.
February 8, 2010 at 4:53 AM #189858AnonymousInactive
Hi guys… Is there a software that I could use to actually mixed the cameras easily rather getting trouble putting on the cables for MCP, as we did MCP to save lots of editing times. This is what we had before when recording an event. And the trouble that we went through getting the cables around, and getting the audio feed from the stage’s mixer is sometimes not worth it. But it’s quite easy doing a MCP during a place like this, plus you could broadcast it live. To safe space, we used only small handycams as you could see parts of the cameras during the performance.
Any one knows how to make their own wireless talkback system? It’s for the director to tell the cameraman what to do. What we actually use was we use the cheap CCTV cables, which has the 2 or 3 video/audio input/output, then we connect the camera’s rca to the yellow cable, we converted using 3.5mm – RCA for ordinary ipod earphone to the cable and at the end of the cable, I used the laptop output to connect all 4 cables and using my headset mic to connect to the laptop to actually talk to the cameraman, but not listen.
As all the yellow cables being connected to the control room, the output from my VX1 mixer is connected to the DVD recorder, a TV backstage and a projector in the stage area where invisible from the cameras, but visible to the cameraman for their monitor. Since it’s so noisy, it’s quite hard for the cameraman to listen what the director actually said during live. So as told before during briefing, ”if you see your camera on air, do not change your shots” sometimes, the director really lazy to keep on saying your camera is up.
Man I love broadcasting even though I’m studying business. Here’s my result for an amateur.
February 9, 2010 at 5:00 PM #189859
Oh man they were terrible! But they were so cute trying so hard I kept watching. I swear the working dog that was visiting my office started howling! They definitely get an A+ in the ‘effort’ dept. in my book.
It’s been a while since I was involved in a broadcast setup so you’ll have to wait for someone else to answer those questions. From a purely filmmaker’s POV, you had the right idea covering different angles and tight shots. All I can say is for your camera guys to a) get more aggressive with their coverage particularly your camera folks covering the stage and b) even though your shooting hand-held, you gotta’ do more to stabilize your shots. Some of those near the stage shots were 6.6 on the ‘Earthquake Cam’ scale.
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