Wedding Business

1. Derek Sine
   Member

   

   If your making Wedding Videos are you doing it part-time on the weekends or is it a full time job?

   Derek Sine
   Trails Ventures, LLC.

   Posted 2 years ago #

2. Don
   Member

   

   Used to be a full time job, but the massive influx of "shoot your wedding for $300.00" amateurs has saturated the market and sales are down to part time status this year. been working more commercial projects to make up difference.....

   Posted 2 years ago #

3. Eventvideoguy
   Member

   

   DOn, I hear alot of people saying they are doing more commercial stuff now.

   Please elaborate on this.  What are you doing commercially and how do you go about getting into this kind of thing; ie clients etc?

    

   Thanks

   Posted 2 years ago #

4. Don
   Member

   

   I take it the Wedding business is down for you as well?

    

   We got some corporate training vids and web advertisers....

   Actually I've turned a lot of wedding vendors we've worked with, into customers, as they need to sell thier products and services online...

   Posted 2 years ago #

5. Derek Sine
   Member

   

   In your area are there a lot of Wedding Videographers?

   Posted 2 years ago #

6. Don
   Member

   

   let me put it this way, between the photography and videography, there are at least sixteen times as many advertising as there were four years ago, almost all at $400.00 or less, half don't even have business licenses.

   anybody with a $500.00 camera is now a "pro!" lol!

    

   I got more calls from competitors posing as customers trying to figure out how much they can get away with charging, than actual customers this year!

   I'm pulling my ad from the yellow pages this year just to avoid wasting time talking to liars.

   It's word of mouth and referrals for us this year.

    

   I see a lot of lawsuits from unhappy customers suing wanna be hacks over the next few years, maybe some City or 'Gubment regulations then, maybe the industry will stabilize somewhat...

   Until then, we'll diversify and keep plugging away at commercial projects, maybe scale down to a half dozen or so weddings next year.

   I have no desire to go out and shoot weddings for pocket change, I work too hard and am wayyy to talented to be wasting my time that way. I'd sooner make independent films outa my own pocket, if people want me to work for nothing.

   Posted 2 years ago #

7. Derek Sine
   Member

   

   I definitely see that around our area as well.

   Posted 2 years ago #

8. Don
   Member

   

   it's too bad, I really love doing weddings.

   but supply and demand....

   I think it'll push down the quality of the industry, but can you blame people for wanting to save money? or make money? 

   times are tough....

    

   I just hope there is still enough demand for high end work to keep us doing what we really love for the next couple years...

   Posted 2 years ago #

9. composite1
   Moderator

   

   "I just hope there is still enough demand for high end work to keep us
   doing what we really love for the next couple years..."

   Don,

   It's the same thing for my biz and I don't shoot weddings! Now everyone thinks they can just grab a cam at Best Buy and whip out a video. But then they can't understand why it doesn't look 'professional'? That and you have the same folks who think you can just make productions for less than $400 dollars and they can't understand 'why they aren't making any money' and their clients can't understand 'why doesn't this look professional?'

   It's the whole 'YouTube' mindset. Now people think that because it's free to put stuff up and watch on the 'Tube that making the content is 'free also'. Now when I started doing this stuff on my own, I did do some pro bono gigs and a few 'ultra discounted' ones too! That didn't last long for as I built my rep I started charging my intended fees which are not as high as other outfits, but my overhead is small enough to do so.

   And you are right, 'times are tough' but the rules haven't changed. You still 'get what you pay for' and the 'buyer must still be aware'.

   H.Wolfgang Porter, Composite Media Producer
   Dreaded Enterprises Unlimited, Inc.
   http://www.dreadedenterprises.com

   Posted 2 years ago #

10. EarlC
    Moderator

    

    Free equals "good enough."

    Cheap equals "cool transitions and wild colorations."

    More than $500 equals "expensive, and damn well better be worth all that money!"

    A thousand equals "I paid THAT much for THIS? And what's with the 30-minute video when we were at it more than 10 hours?"

    Over a thousand equals "For that price I should get unlimited hours and all the DVD copies I want."

    More than two K equals "How about I pass on the HD copy on BluRay, poop-can the love story, montage, bridal prep, groom prep, highlights, kitchen sink, bathroom remodeling, my first son's circumcision and you knock that down to $1K - $900 would be even better."

    Five thousand or higher often equals "I got all the above and a college education for my first-born. GREAT DEAL!"

    More than 10K equals "Really? Kind of cheap, don't you think honey. Now, about that seventy-five-thousand-dollar dress, and the dozen ice sculptures..."

    Weddings, for me, even as little as 10 years ago were plentiful when I was promoting what I referred to as "the kitchen sink" tossing in everything I could image for $1,200. We rode that puppy for a long time...

    ...too long, and it really tarnished my attitude toward wedding video production as the base for my full-time business as an independent video services provider. I developed a plan to diversify and market, over the years accumulating a lot of demo event production material and a few low/medium budget commercial gigs, to the point that pretty much anything somebody approaches me on, I can show a demo, get the signature and make some money.

    ALWAYS, this has resulted in MORE bucks per hour than on any wedding I've ever done. WELL, with ONE exception. I did shoot two hours of pre-ceremony, ceremony and post-ceremony, one camera, in-camera edited and handing over two tapes at the end, for $500. So THAT one was nice, coming in at $250 per hour, no post work.

    My highest paying wedding gig EVER was several years ago, and grossed me $8K. It still wasn't worth the amount of time, energy and pain that came with the gig.

    My lowest paying wedding gig EVER (other than a couple freebies for family in Texas - negative income when you count the plane fare) was eight hours coverage, two cameras and operators, highlights all for $450. I did exactly two of these, then spent the rest of my life regretting doing them.

    Interesting story, IMHO:

    Once upon a time we did a two-hour office party Christmas Holiday gig, shooting the sales awards winners, videotaping the hapless magician who made sanitary commode covers appear magically out of VP's wallets, then hung them around their necks.

    Came the VP in charge of budgetary matters (CPA in anyone else's language) turn to get "roasted" - he and his secretary were planning a wedding and Bahama honeymoon in a few and the company was springing for most of it. Hmmmm...

    Should have known when, in jest he pulled out his wallet in a skit that focused on how "tight" he tended to be, used a chisel to open it and blew (talcum powder) dust out of it before extracting a old and wrinkled silver certificate dollar bill. ANYWAY...

    The wife-to-be calls up the NEXT DAY and says: "We WANT YOU. YOU'RE BOOKED! This is our date and you guys are GREAT! We LOVE how you work, and the two-camera approach is really, REALLY nice!"

    I hung up the phone elated. Well, my associate, a bit underwhelmed and being a female was much more astute than myself. She calls the gal back and says, "Don't you even want to know what it costs?'

    "Oh, that's not a problem at all," says the client. "We're totally positive that you guys will do the same great job for us that you did for the company party, and $250 is such a GREAT BARGAIN!"

    My associate advised her that there was, if not a miscommunication, at least a misperception on their part because our base price was closer to $850 (at the time) and only included eight hours. We were advised that the event would be 10 hours, two locations, and they would not pay MORE than $250 - what was paid for the holiday party.

    We agreed to call them back and tell them OK, "...cut the hours in half, to four, and double what you're willing to spend, and we'll do your wedding with EVERY BIT of the enthusiasm with which we did the holiday party. That will be $500. Are we still booked?"

    "We NEVER booked you. We would NEVER have agreed to even CONSIDER booking ANYBODY for wedding video for MORE than $250!"

    Dang, we lost THAT gig. 

    Posted 2 years ago #

11. composite1
    Moderator

    

    "We would NEVER have agreed to even CONSIDER booking ANYBODY for wedding
    video for MORE than $250"

    I hate effin' weddings. They are so retarded. A couple is willing to spend thousands if not tens of thousands of dollars on the look of the ceremony, the venue, the 'one-time-only dress' and all the other transient items that nobody will remember days later. But the things that will last a lifetime like the wedding photos and video they want to skimp on?

    Now just like Grinner mentioned in another post, when clients who know how important all this is and are willing to pay for a quality product, they are a joy to behold. Weddings still suck, but when the client understands that you get what you pay for and wants you to do your best, that takes some of the 'suckage' out of the ordeal.

    I recently shot a wedding for one of my regular crew as a gift. He's worked on paying and non-paying gigs without so much as a whine. I charged him my mileage and the cost of my lodgings. Anybody else pays full price.

    Posted 2 years ago #

12. Don
    Member

    

    When I shoot a wedding:

    there are sales and pre wedding consults...2-3 hours of my time plus coffee.

    an engagement photo shoot. 1-1 1/2 hours.

    prep work including charging batteries, cleaning lenses, testing and packing equipment. 2 hours.

    lighting and sound check and final instructions... usually at the rehearsal... 1-3hours.

    full day event coverage. 6-12 hours.

    photos and video x2 photographers.

    photo thank you cards printed at the reception.

    video presentation of images shot during the day, at the reception, as well as select video clips.

    photo books, prints, enlargements, dvd's with chapters and slide shows and titles. (6-14 hours post)

    a web page with photos and video.

    no GDam way am I picking up a camera for under two grand four hundred.

    I won't book for less and risk having to turn away a full package customer, and we have a vj you own party service (we supply equipment and technician, to help you host your own party, you supply your own photos, videos and music) for people on a budget.

    sooooo...

     times are a changin'

    we'll live with it, see what happens next.

    Posted 2 years ago #

13. Don
    Member

    

    somebody might consider this an acceptable photo :

    

    can get thier friends or some hack to shoot thier Wedding.

    those that want me: know why I charge more.

    

     

    I mean they're both strawberries right?

    Posted 2 years ago #

14. Judy
    Member

    

    I do have a full time video business. I have been in the Wedding Photo/Video business 20 years and I had the worst year I ever had in business last year. My business was down 20 to 30 percent.  I noticed a difference the minute the stock market crashed in Nov. 2008.  My phones just stop ringing for a while.  Most of my spring 2009 business was already booked so that wasn't to bad, but Fall 2009 was way down (Brides book you about six months in advance).  This years weddings in Michigan are way down. Last spring I had 10 weddings booked April-June.  This year I have three.  Just talk to your halls and even the priest at the local church they will tell you people are taking this year off from getting married and saving up.  Those that are out there this year have bargaining power and know it!  I have cut my rates just to bring business in.    I have to pay the rent!   I have picked up video business  in other areas and thank God I have photography  too.   When video seems down my photo business will bring in business.  However I love the video end of the business way better.  It is much easier to deal with.    I do see 2011 being a much better year.   We all just have to get there       Oh, and yes I have seen  a flooded market of videographers and even more photographers in the past four years!  Anyone with a camera is hanging a shingle out on the internet and calling themselves pro.    Sorry I rambled on...it was my first post.

    Posted 2 years ago #

15. composite1
    Moderator

    

    Judy,

    Ramble accepted. Welcome aboard.

    Posted 2 years ago #

16. EarlC
    Moderator

    

    Glad you chimed in, Judy. I'm getting tired of reading all of Composite's posts ;-)

    Fresh blood. Fresh blood. Every stinkin' word you said was true judy.

    Posted 2 years ago #

17. composite1
    Moderator

    

    "I'm getting tired of reading all of Composite's posts...."

    Slings and arrows my friend! Yeah, the last couple of months have had some interesting topics pop up. Besides, I just wanted to beat Derek as top poster for at least one month!

    Posted 2 years ago #

18. CraftersOfLight
    Member

    

     Thumb's Up on Composite for taking time to explain things. He and EarlC knocks the socks off the one-liners that post, at least it helps me understand better where they are coming from.

    Life is not a guided tour nor a destination.
    It is a journey. Take the time to enjoy your family, friends and surroundings.
    Build memories. Share experiences. Travel at sight speed not light speed. (C)

    Posted 2 years ago #

19. EarlC
    Moderator

    

    Derek? Beat HIM? Ain't gonna happen, boy's prolific personified :-) I KNOW, YOU know I was JK with you, but simply could not pass up the shot.

    Now, ya gotta ask yourself if Crafters is pulling an April Fool's routine on the two of us - already my head is swollen to the point I am housebound. :-)

    Thanks Crafters, positive comments are always appreciated.

    Posted 2 years ago #

20. Derek Sine
    Member

    

    I love reading all of your posts!

    Posted 2 years ago #

21. composite1
    Moderator

    

    "Derek? Beat HIM? Ain't gonna happen..."

    Oh contrare you're 'Earlness'. In my best Al Pachino voice from 'Devil's Advocate', "Ya' gotta' admit, the entire Month of March was all mine!" I just wanted to see if it could be done. Mountain summit reached, onto the next thing. Oh and without doubt sir I knew you were making with the merry.

    Posted 2 years ago #

22. marty
    Member

    

     Jeez. ,makes me want to jump into Wedding Videography "NOT".

    And sounds like I have one to shoot in June

    Posted 2 years ago #

23. EarlC
    Moderator

    

    OK Marty, now ya got me curious. How does having a wedding to shoot in June "SOUND" :-) And what key is that?

    Posted 2 years ago #

24. composite1
    Moderator

    

    "... Makes me want to jump into Wedding Videography "NOT"."

    Marty,

    In defense of WV, it can be a rewarding line of work if you can wade through the kind of clientele we mentioned and reach the 'Cadillac Clients'. Not so much as them being well to do (though that helps) but understanding that you don't get 'special work' for $500 bucks or less unless you know someone good at what they do and they do you a favor.

    There is a movement towards high-end wedding 'films' that offer bigger production values that make for a lasting and memorable experience for wedding clients. It is painfully obvious that a) you're not going to get one of these done for $500 bucks!  And b) with the economy as it is, you as the artist will have to figuratively 'leave quite the trail of bodies' to build a rep to reach these kinds of clients. Here are some wedding filmmakers who are at the top of this new game discussing their craft and customers in Steve Weise's "Film Fellas".

    Get the Flash Video

    .

    Posted 2 years ago #

25. oc6088
    Member

    

    I stumbled across a statistic a while ago, although I can't quote the source at the top of my head, that 98% of brides/grooms hire a professional photographer only 29% of them hire a professional videographer. 

     

    Yes, I have also had people want to hire me for $200 to shot a wedding.  They don't have any problem though paying $2000 for a photographer!  I don't get it.  We have audio..we have movement. 

     

    I have been debating on advertising weddings anymore also.  Every time I do one anyhow I feel like I lose 3 years off of my life.  I am thinking just doing the free online sites and putting it on my website.

     

    Posted 2 years ago #

26. daryldrj
    Member

    

    You should see the Pro work for weddings here in Ukraine. If you could get past this Government riff-Raff what a business you could have here. Most of the pros here put up the most corny  Wedding Videos I have ever seen and the get paid good money for this stuff

    Posted 2 years ago #

27. EarlC
    Moderator

    

    IMHO most wedding production work beyond good, solid camerawork and framing, color and audio is essentially an industry mind...k attempt on the bridal clients. Sure there are the occasional bridal clients who actually WANT the Hollywood-style treatments, the wonderfully cinematic productions and are on rare occasion willing to pay the price for that creative approach and quality.

    But, again IMHO, the average bride who even THINKS she wants video done by a so-called or self-professed professional, or true professional FWIW, isn't going to spend major bucks to acquire that, and is only interested in the meat-and-potatoes as indicated above - solid camerawork, color and audio.

    If a wedding video artist wants to throw in the other stuff she will take it, but often will not be willing (based on a host of reasons and rationalizations beyond budget or available Daddy Cash) to consider or discuss these elements as additional cost premium inclusions for her package.

    This is, again, the average bridal client, not that upper 1 percent who wants and expects everything based on a stratospheric budget level.

    Another reality of the wedding video industry is that virtually ALL wedding video service providers, from the most expensive and capable artist to the Christmas camera wannabe are fighting for the same small wedge of bridal client video pie - often stated in the 20-to-28-percent range of available potential market. The remaining 70-to-80 percent couldn't care less for professionally (in whatever definition that applies) produced video of their event.

    They are simply NOT interested. Could they be convinced to reconsider? I have often thought so, but even though I have personally pounded on various organizations posing as marketing groups, individuals and forum members that the wedding video industry at large needs a "Got Milk" or "Where's the Beef" type campaign, or actually maybe something a bit more sophisticated, they are not interested.

    It would appear that by and large the independent wedding video services providers are too independent and essentially too heavily focused on either selling their "secrets" to up-and-comers (newbies) or continue to fight for that tiny wedge of potential bridal clients who actually see some value in obtaining video production from an experienced wedding video producer.

    Folks who focus primarily on wedding video production, either as a part-time augmentation of their income, something to do for fun, or full-time career/business move are too focused on their individual business needs to have the time or inclination to band together in an effort to develop a sophisticated "awareness" campaign that might draw in MORE interest and a broader available client base. Shame.

    Posted 2 years ago #

28. daryldrj
    Member

    

    By The way I do a few Weddings part time I guess but I try and limit this to very few

    Posted 2 years ago #

29. birdcat
    Moderator

    

    I don't do weddings for a number of reasons.  I did one as a gift for a friend - I spent a minimum of 12 hours with the bride & groom all day taping (over eight hours of tape between the preparations shadowing, ceremony & reception - I was the only shooter).  About 100 hours editing (yes I know I'm a lunatic) and that's not counting the incidentals like renders, authoring, burns & packaging - I wouldn't have charged less than $5K if I were to do this for a living.

    My hat's off to you folks who make a living at this.

    Bruce Paul
    7Squared Productions
    http://www.7squared.com

    Posted 2 years ago #

30. Anonymous
    

    

     Hi Earl,

    Are you referring to WEVA? You certainly offer valid points. WEVA outlines and representa really high expectations/standards for the wedding video business in general. We've been filming weddings part time for 3+ years now and from my experience, the majority of couples are still not sold on having their wedding filmed..Why? Lack of budget, family member can do it for free, or my personal favorite , seeing their friends/family's really bad wedding video....

    I commend WEVA and other high end wedding video outfits like StillMotion, Jason Magbanua, PaperCranes for pushing the envelope on wedding videos; but in the end, they cater to a different, higher end market compared to what the majority of wedding videographers target.

    Cheers,

    Kren

    http://www.verticalvideoworks.com

    Posted 2 years ago #

RSS feed for this topic

youtube, myvideo, funnyordie, gametrailers, collegehumor, dailymotion, glumbert, liveleak, redtube, googlevideo, sevenload, metacafe, clipfish, vimeo