http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ Videomaker Community Forums » Forum: Making Profit - Recent Posts en Fri, 17 Feb 2012 03:16:30 +0000 http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/to-buy-or-rent-thats-a-good-question#post-74798 Wed, 15 Feb 2012 03:47:55 +0000 Larry Williams 74798@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p> my experence is i like to own my equipment. I rented a couple of time while in film school because the lack eqipment to students for a project. After my first year i looked at the cost for rental of the camera (xl2) and mics to the price of one and i realized i could have bought a refurbished one for around the same price. now that was for school projects so that cut into my pocket without getting any money out of it. Ever sense then i have been buying equipment. The main reason i buy is becasue its my equipment and i make more money and if i learn something new in camera or in post i can just go out and shoot practice footage eaisly. so bottom line i think you will profit more from owning equipment </p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/what-should-i-charge-1#post-74795 Wed, 15 Feb 2012 02:56:30 +0000 Larry Williams 74795@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p> i have recently came into a simular problem not an over all pricing but pricing for greenscreen editing </p> <p>I noticed its starting to hit my pockets but its not doing that when i do shoots in natual locations it when i do a green screen, between the rendering and editing green screen footage it makes the edit process brutal. i charged 400 for a 5 minute music video but i was editing green screen fotage on both of my macs for about a total of 18 hours in doing that pushed back a couple of my other projects i was working on baically what im asking is does anyone have advice about the editing of greenscreen and should i charge a put up and tear down fee </p> <p>i have a big arsonel of equipment also that is all paid off becasue of military duties </p> <p>equipment i have</p> <p>canon T2I mulitple lenses</p> <p>Canon xha1</p> <p>steadicam with vest and spring arm </p> <p>8-12 foot crane</p> <p>tripods</p> <p>monopod</p> <p>tripod dollies </p> <p>green screen set up </p> <p>lighting </p> <p>microphones </p> <p>reflectors </p> <p>a 20 inch imac with fcp7 and 13 inch macbookpro with fcp7and pc with sony vegas and sony music studio</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/what-should-i-charge-1#post-74787 Tue, 14 Feb 2012 20:22:09 +0000 cfxcorp 74787@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>You have to ask yourself, too...Do you want to do this work at these rates?&nbsp; Word gets out and you will probably get referrals that you may or may not want to commit to.&nbsp; Can you sub the work out (supervise it) and then mark it up X% ?</p> <p>I think your price is reasonable for the time you estimated.&nbsp; This project will add to your portfolio so you can show the next potential client what they will get for their money and your time.</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/what-should-i-charge-1#post-74786 Tue, 14 Feb 2012 19:59:39 +0000 Kolyssa 74786@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>I have so much equipment because it's all I ask for on christmas lists, birthday lists, etc. and all the money I make from video production goes right back to buy more equipment :) You could say video is my life... because it is at the moment. </p> <p>Oaken Beeson, where are you located? That might make a difference. I feel like if I charge that much people might not take me seriously. But then again I've never tried. Also I'm only 21. I'm located in Milwaukee WI. </p> <p>I decided to charge $2500 for the entire project.</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/to-buy-or-rent-thats-a-good-question#post-74748 Mon, 13 Feb 2012 19:30:27 +0000 composite1 74748@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p><em>"A client doesn't know, or care, whether you own or rent your gear, just how much the job will cost."</em></p> <p>Jack,</p> <p>True, but.... I've lost jobs because the cost of renting gear and making a profit was higher than if I had the gear. You're right, client's do care about how much the job will cost. I get calls from clients who are hell bent to have their projects shot with RED cameras. That is until I hit them with the rental costs for not just the gear, but all the supporting gear and storage. </p> <p>If you're paying out more money for rental gear than you're going to get when you don't have the gear, that's a 'cut in your profits'. Now I get your point about clients paying. That works when you have an established outfit and your clients are fully aware and fully capable to pay for what is necessary. When you're starting out and or a small outfit, those clients are rare. Most times you'll be doing your best to not freak them out when they see how much it will cost with a big rental package. </p> <p>So when you asked 'how would any cost cut deep into your profits?' that's how. Not being able to do a job because renting will drive up the cost of your proposal is a serious 'profit cutter' in my opinion.</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/to-buy-or-rent-thats-a-good-question#post-74683 Sat, 11 Feb 2012 23:07:50 +0000 Rocky 74683@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>&nbsp;If you rent a piece of equipment more than five times in three years, its then more economical to purchase that equipment, with extended warranty. Other advantages&nbsp;to owning is that you become totally familar with the equipment and there is nothing to stop you invoicing its use&nbsp;out at normal rental card rates.&nbsp;Ideally&nbsp;I try to&nbsp;update cameras&nbsp;between three to four years at which time&nbsp;its second hand price and avoidance of any service&nbsp;costs make&nbsp;the venture&nbsp;economically viable.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/to-buy-or-rent-thats-a-good-question#post-74681 Sat, 11 Feb 2012 22:30:47 +0000 jackwolcott 74681@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>Composite1: I'm confused. Why should any cost "cut deep into your profits?" Profits come above costs, not despite costs. All costs should be taken into account when quoting a price for the job to a client, including your salary, equipment rental and amortization costs, transportation, meals, etc.  Additionally,  added a cushion for unexpected contingencies and percentage above costs for profit. </p> <p>A client doesn't know, or care, whether you own or rent your gear, just how much the job will cost.</p> <p>Jack</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/to-buy-or-rent-thats-a-good-question#post-74680 Sat, 11 Feb 2012 21:41:03 +0000 composite1 74680@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>In my experience, rent when you have a client willing to pay for gear you don't have or if your budget supports it. Renting can cut deep into your profits. Now if you're wanting to work with cinema primes or need a steady rig for a heavier camera, etc. yeah renting is the way to roll. But if the rental percentage cost is greater than your profit percentage, that's when having your own gear comes in handy.</p> <p> </p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/to-buy-or-rent-thats-a-good-question#post-74674 Sat, 11 Feb 2012 15:02:24 +0000 Cinebasics 74674@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>I also own prosumer(xf100, 5d etc.) but rent pro when needed. I tell people starting out to at least own something, even a d3100 or and old hmc40 but have something to learn on and use whenever you want. When you get good and can use any camera sight unseen them you move to renting. Whih is the opposite I hear from other people, but that's my take.</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/what-should-i-charge-1#post-74673 Sat, 11 Feb 2012 14:55:31 +0000 Cinebasics 74673@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>I'm kinda impressed with the amount of gear you have for a beginner, so to speak. That's more than what most people use unless you're borrowing or renting all that. All I can tell you is what I charge, which is the best way to come up with prices. Try and find people who do w the kind of work you do and see what they charge. I'm at 125 hour for shooting and 85 an hour for editing. So far no one complains ;)</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/what-should-i-charge-1#post-74648 Fri, 10 Feb 2012 16:16:54 +0000 Kolyssa 74648@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>@Mike, That's a brilliant website! Thanks for the link! I've always been slightly opposed to hourly rates only because I was living in a college dorm and my hours would often be interrupted by roommates or other things. But now that I have my own office space I think you're right, I should consider that! I think $50/hour sounds reasonable... here's my equipment list:</p> <p>Panasonic GH1 with multiple lenses</p> <p>Canon 550D with multiple lenses</p> <p>Tripods, monopods, etc.</p> <p>Boom mic, lapel mic, hand-held mic + Zoom H4n Recorder</p> <p>LED lighting</p> <p>Adobe CS5.5 on my 27" iMac (I also have FCPX, but I prefer Adobe...).</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/to-buy-or-rent-thats-a-good-question#post-74646 Fri, 10 Feb 2012 15:03:05 +0000 Mike Wilhelm 74646@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>I am a very big proponent of renting gear, at least to start. It's very easy to justify equipment cost to your clients when you have an accurate, per-day cost to use it. After working with rental gear for a while, you should have a good idea of the kind of equipment you use all the time, as opposed to equipment that is merely situational. </p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/what-should-i-charge-1#post-74645 Fri, 10 Feb 2012 14:51:41 +0000 Mike Wilhelm 74645@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>Have you considered coming up with an hourly rate as opposed to a per-minute finished rate? Check out this rate calculator: <a href="http://freelanceswitch.com/rates/">http://freelanceswitch.com/rates/</a></p> <p>I'd say $50-$100 /hour would be a reasonable rate, depending of course on what equipment you're using.</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/what-should-i-charge-1#post-74644 Fri, 10 Feb 2012 13:50:54 +0000 Kolyssa 74644@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>Hello! I found this forum on Google and I've seen lots of experienced people giving their advice here, so I thought I would try it out!</p> <p>I usually charge $100/min of edited footage when I make promo or recap videos. (So a 5 min video = $500). That's perfect for my target audience and the kind of videos I make. However, I was recently approached with a project that I am unsure how to price. Here are the details:</p> <p>8 to 10 videos at 15-20 minutes each. The content is educational lecture. We'll probably spend a day (8 hours) filming all the videos, then my guess is that it will take about 60 hours of editing to get everything put together within the next 3 months (I'm a college student with classes so yes, it will take that long). With my *usual* pricing formula, the quote could be like $15,000!!! And that's way out of my client's budget. I understand that the editing for these videos will actually be minimal compared to my usual work :::::: <a href="https://vimeo.com/17085389" rel="nofollow">https://vimeo.com/17085389</a> ::::: so it will cost less. But I also don't want to be taken advantage of.</p> <p>If you need to know anything else, please let me know! Other than that any advice is very appreciated :)</p> <p>-Kolyssa</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/to-buy-or-rent-thats-a-good-question#post-74643 Fri, 10 Feb 2012 13:44:39 +0000 Don 74643@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>thanx for the video..</p> <p>my take is buy what you can afford, rent when what you own isn't right for the job.</p> <p>that way you always got your gear.... even if you wind up using your gear as "Back-up or b roll" on a job... the main problem with rentals is availability, and familiarity... </p> <p>I own prosumer gear and rent pro gear as needed.</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/to-buy-or-rent-thats-a-good-question#post-74638 Fri, 10 Feb 2012 11:37:04 +0000 composite1 74638@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>Whether you've been in the biz for a while or just starting up a hobby, the big question is; Should I buy or rent?</p> <p>In my experience, I've done both and there were pro's and con's with either. These days with gear being truly affordable, there is an incentive to purchase equipment and accessories outright. However, there are unseen costs that come with both purchasing and renting gear. Here's a vid from Caleb Pike that gives a solid analysis of this very important question....</p> <p><a href="http://vimeo.com/36359388">Owning Gear</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/calebpike">Caleb Pike</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/30-off-funeral-book#post-74299 Sun, 29 Jan 2012 12:52:17 +0000 EarlC 74299@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>Thanks so very much, guys, for the wonderful endorsements. Very MUCH appreciated. I'm wrapping Book Two, "Make Money Marketing &amp; Producing Photo Montages: The Complete Guide" and it should be available for pre-sales mid-February, delivery by end of February. I intend to continue with the Videomaker magazine classified ad but will change copy to reflect availability of the new book when the time comes. Thanks again, Earl</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/question-direct-to-tv-documentary-production#post-74292 Sun, 29 Jan 2012 11:03:41 +0000 Charles Schultz 74292@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>You can ask the TV service provider which format is most acceptable. Most will accept both formats. Also, it is my experience that they prefer 30 fps but if you ask the provider they should provide you with format specs to help you out. I am not sure of how shooting in NTSC will effect over seas sales as most of Europe is PAL while some countries use NTSC.</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/question-direct-to-tv-documentary-production#post-74284 Sun, 29 Jan 2012 00:56:07 +0000 nevart 74284@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>If I am shooting for broadcast TV, should I use standard 4:3 or 16:9?  Which is more likely to be accepted?  Also is it a bad idea to use 24P mode for TV?  I thought it may enhance the look of the work even though it is not a cinematic production.  Finally, if I do this in NTSC is that going to have a negative impact on the ability to sell to international markets?</p> <p> </p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/30-off-funeral-book#post-74266 Sat, 28 Jan 2012 16:40:48 +0000 Charles Schultz 74266@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>I definitely think this is one of the best packages for marketing and working the shoots. Earl has included some very good examples and the one of the military shoot was awesome. Highly recommend!!</p> <p> </p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/30-off-funeral-book#post-74264 Sat, 28 Jan 2012 14:45:55 +0000 Summerrose 74264@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>&nbsp;I highly recommend this book. I stand by the 5-star rating given to it, including one from me!</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/30-off-funeral-book#post-74260 Sat, 28 Jan 2012 11:49:46 +0000 EarlC 74260@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>I'm currently running an ad in Videomaker magazine for "They Shoot Funerals, Don't They: Complete Guide to Funeral Video Production &amp; Marketing" but <a href="http://www.lulu.com">LuluDOTCom</a> is offering a coupon good for 30% off ... coupon SHELFSTOCK305 ... through Jan 31.</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/7-types-of-clients-you-should-avoid#post-74155 Mon, 23 Jan 2012 09:39:29 +0000 birdcat 74155@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>I dunno - Avoid is a good word for some wannabe client's.</p> <p>I just turned down one clown who wanted me to take his 10-12 hours of wedding footage (three cams), capture it, edit two videos - long form and highlights then author &amp; burn a DVD - and his budget I was supposed to do this for (drum roll) - $150 (he had lots of work for that price).  </p> <p>I may not have been 100% kind when I turned him down.</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/7-types-of-clients-you-should-avoid#post-74132 Sat, 21 Jan 2012 12:24:28 +0000 jackwolcott 74132@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>"Avoid" may be too strong a word, but one type of potential client to be <em>wary</em> of is the company or agency which wants you to submit a lengthy proposal for a project they have in mind. Often the back story runs like this: the boss says to his secretary: Here's what I want done. Find out how much it will cost."</p> <p>So the secretary emails you and asks you to develop a proposal. You spend several hours figuring costs, calling back and forth with your contact to attempt to firm up vaporous details, and lining up people who will be your sub contractors -- audio, graphics, etc., -- and never hear from the contact again. </p> <p>Why? Because the secretary is in the middle; she has no decision-making power and, once she has turned in all her facts, it's the boss who calls the shots. And all he cares about is what it will cost him. So he decides that his nephew will use the camera he got for Christmas to do the job, the details of which the boss still isn't clear about! And chances are the project never happens. You've spent several hours of your life working on a project for which you will never be paid a dime!</p> <p>Always work with the decision maker directly. It's one of the first things I ask when approached, especially if the inquiry is from a governmental agency, where you're typically dealing with a committee: "Who is the boss?"</p> <p>Shooting things at schools fall into this category. Find out the specific person who will be approving what you do and who will be paying you. Don't accept "It's coming from the PSTA" or "The choral club will be paying you." Have your contract signed by the person whose name will appear on the check. It's him or her that you have to please, and it's this person, not you, who will have to negotiate with the rest of the committee. </p> <p>Finally, you only have one thing in life to sell and that's your time. Make it clear from the outset with any client that you'll be paid for any time you spend on the project. Have a contract that spells this out in detail. If you have to drive half an hour each way to get to the client's office for meetings, and you're expected to spend a couple of hours discussing storyboard, that's three hours of your life that you could have been editing or shooting. Have all of that time spent covered in your contract.</p> <p>Being a nice guy is part of being professional. So is getting paid for the time you spend with a job. I can be incredibly accommodating with even the most difficult client so long as I'm being paid by the hour.</p> <p>Jack</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/7-types-of-clients-you-should-avoid#post-74131 Sat, 21 Jan 2012 10:20:40 +0000 EarlC 74131@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>As much as we need and want the business, as desperate as we become for a bit of cash flow, it is important that we as creative professionals and as businesspeople determine and recognize our worth and be true to ourselves.</p> <p>There are certainly occasions when our individual economic situations are such that we are compelled to take whatever we can get simply to survive but survival isn't always based on making a dollar. It is based on sustaining SOME level of value for ourselves and our industry by walking away from gigs, Luis, where people you refer to as "cheapskate clients" fail to understand or appreciate our personal, professional and business worth.</p> <p>Until more independent professional video services providers stand solid and not "give it away" simply because they're either not concerned about profit, don't realize that profit is important, or are simply videographers who don't need to worry about price or value there will be difficultly dealing with this category. At some point we have to realize that this type of client is simply NOT worth it in the long run or short run.</p> <p>Bottom line is be true to yourself, your personal AND REAL sense of worth, your business needs and either hone your marketing skills to overcome such mentality, or walk away. Or, you can always refer such clients to others in the video business (we all know some) for whom business and profit are concepts to be ignored.</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/7-types-of-clients-you-should-avoid#post-74130 Sat, 21 Jan 2012 10:06:15 +0000 SargeHero 74130@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>I found this interesting <a title="7 Types of clients you should avoid at all cost" href="http://www.momeomagazine.com/business-101-disaster-clients-the-7-types-of-clients-you-should-avoid-at-all-costs/">article </a>that talks about 7 types of clients that should be avoided. In my personal experience in the video production world I have stumble upon at least 5 of this clients. In my opinion the worst and most common in the video business are the "cheapskate clients", which are not willing to pay for your hard work and expect a lot of things for less. </p> <p>I would really like to hear how Videomaker community deals with this type of clients. Any awful experience? Any advise for the video business newbies? </p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/working-for-free#post-74097 Thu, 19 Jan 2012 18:56:34 +0000 Petar 74097@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>Me no expert but you need to do some projects for free for confidence and respect, only you can decide when you start charging people for your work. You dont have to be scared if you ask money for your work its how business works.</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/more-newbie-questions-about-pricing#post-74040 Mon, 16 Jan 2012 22:54:05 +0000 Mark 74040@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>As someone who is about to venture into the paid world of videography, I wonder day and night what to charge. I have quoted a few people lower than average just to gain the experience, and have the ability to put a reel together showing the different events I can and will do. I want to get my name out there and I think the more events I am exposed to during this self imposed "trial" period will go a long way into gaining more customers down the road and as I gain more confidence, my rates will begin to reflect that.</p> <p>I am in the process of editing so many pieces I did for ZERO money, for nothing else than adding to my reel. Plus it gives me the practice to master Final Cut and try things out that I might not have taken the time to learn otherwise.</p> <p>I want to be able to live off my earnings, but I also have to build up awareness, so I don't want to come out of the gate and charge 3,500 for a Wedding, when I have yet to shoot one. I would rather go lower, and impress the couple, they get a deal and I have something I am proud of to show the next couple. As I do that and I experience what happens in the course of a wedding day, I can begin to make more effective quotes. The goal a year from now would be the ability to charge a minimum of $100 an hour for a local gig. And concentrate on other events than just weddings. But weddings introduce you to a lot of people that have other things going on, so I have no problem charging from the bottom and working up as skills, and economy improve.</p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/live-event-webcasting-business-info#post-74016 Sun, 15 Jan 2012 18:29:28 +0000 SargeHero 74016@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>I recommend networking on Linkedin. I have found some gigs by just commenting on Linkedin groups, basically, giving advise for free to someone who could potentially become a client of mine. Another thing you can do is ask your family and friends for people they may know that could be interested in your services. Almost all my gigs had been from referrals, so start letting people know you as the go-to guy for video services and live webcasting. </p> http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/topic/live-event-webcasting-business-info#post-74003 Sun, 15 Jan 2012 07:17:11 +0000 pskyler 74003@http://www.videomaker.com/community/forums/ <p>I an considering offering  live event webcasting along with other vider services I offer in my video business. Does anyone know of a place I can get more information on how to find clients who may need this service?</p>